What I LIKE and Don't Like About WoW Forever

Storyline / Setting (Lore Framing)

• WoW Forever is presented as an alternate timeline branching from a point in WoW history.
• The speaker emphasizes no retconning: events in this timeline don’t change retail Warcraft canon.
• The team allows creative freedom because this “Forever” timeline exists alongside—but remains separate from—the main retail lore.
• Skyborn is treated as a lore variant of the high elf concept, with the speaker arguing that hatred toward it is partly due to misunderstanding/overreaction.

Gameplay Highlights / Systems Discussed

Monetization & Access Model (Major Focus)

• No traditional box price; play is subscription-based.
• The $30 Edition includes access to the Skyborn race (optional).
• Blizzard confirmed no WoW Token and no level boosts for WoW Forever.
• The target is to reach critical mass at $15/month to get more players playing quickly.

Core “Classic” Philosophy

• Level cap stays at 60 forever, focusing on long-term content structure rather than continual “level expansion.”
• No world buffs in raids (called out as a major win).
• Realms / no realms is treated as a major improvement, with implications for how factions are handled on PvP rulesets.

Races / Identity Elements

• Skyborn is considered acceptable by the speaker, though they personally prefer something closer to:
  • High Elf (Alliance) + Forsaken Elf (Horde)
• Undead Paladin is specifically praised as a strong addition.

UI / Presentation

• Biggest dislike: Retail UI presence.
  • The speaker wants a toggle back to classic UI (not necessarily removal of retail UI).
• Energy “manatics” / tick system:
  • The speaker wants classic tick behavior back, describing it as returning combat “ticks.”
• Character presentation:
  • SD character models toggle is praised.
  • Animations: the speaker likes reduced “bounciness”, and suggests retail could benefit from removing it too.
  • Water visuals are praised.
• Mobility:
  • Boats for travel are praised—faster than walking but not full flight, and they encourage social interaction while traveling.

Combat & Combat Balance Changes (Key Concerns + Examples)

AoE Nerfs / AoE Cap Concept

• AoE damage is described as being fully effective up to a target cap, then becoming reduced beyond that point.
• Example: Paladin Consecration can hit more than four targets, but deals lower damage after the cap.

Dungeon XP Changes (Discouraging Repetition Farming)

• Dungeon kill XP is reduced
• Dungeon quests are made more rewarding
• Expected result:
  • The first run of a dungeon should feel great
  • Repeat runs shouldn’t become the dominant optimal strategy

Weapon Power Tuning for Casters

• Concern: potential power inflation and early overpowered gear.
• Blizzard’s explanation (as relayed by the speaker):
  • Move more of the “power feel” into spellcaster weapons
  • So caster weapon upgrades feel as impactful as melee weapon upgrades
  • Without adding extra raw power

Progression / Alt Incentives

Legacy System (Liked, Mostly)

• The speaker likes it for:
  • Giving reasons to level alts
  • Providing unlockable progression goals

Major Issue: Talent Points at Level 5

• The speaker strongly dislikes:
  • Talent points starting at level 5 via legacy
• They view it as too strong and likely to break balance (e.g., threat issues, DPS/tank problems).
• Suggested fix:
  • Remove or gut talent points at level 5

Horizontal Progression

• Horizontal progression is praised as “amazing.”

PvP Philosophy

• The speaker prefers classic-like PvP without retail-style rating sweat:
  • No arenas
  • No battleground rating / no RBG rating (as far as they understand)
• The expectation is more world PvP events and world objectives.

“Ranking” vs “Rating”

• “Ranking” is described as time investment / preparation, not pure skill/grind feeding into rating.

• This is contrasted with retail’s rating systems where skill/grind directly drives rating.

• A mention is made of debuff limit removed, though it’s unclear if fully confirmed; the speaker treats it as part of the current picture.

Strategies / Key Tips (As Described)

• Avoid dungeon-spam as an “optimal route,” since the system is meant to prevent repeat dungeons from outperforming questing/exploring.
• For power progression:
  • Learn the AoE cap/nerf mechanics (especially for mage AoE grinding styles).
  • Watch for legacy power spikes if level 5 talent points remain unchanged—speaker implies this could distort dungeon runs and threat management.

What the Speaker Likes / Doesn’t Like / Is Indifferent About

What They Like (Big Items)

• No flying
• 60 cap forever + continual content updates
• Subscription-only access concept ($15)
• Cheaper than expected overall pricing
• No WoW Token / no level boosts
• No world buffs in raids
• SD model toggle
• Animations less “bouncy”
• Realms removed / no realms (“W”)
• Boats for mobility (social travel pace)
• World/quest-friendly dungeon reward tuning (via dungeon XP changes)
• Undead Paladin

What They Don’t Like (Big Items)

• Retail UI needs a toggle to classic UI
• Tick-based combat behavior / energy mechanics should return (wants classic tick feel)
• Legacy talent points at level 5 are “too OP” and should be removed/gutted
• Potential AoE cap ambiguity (wants specifics)
• Potential power creep risk from early gear itemization
  • Even with Blizzard’s weapon-power explanation, they remain concerned
• Barber system could reduce character identity (if gender/hair customization exists beyond what the speaker likes)

Indifferent / Mixed

• Skyborn (acceptable, but they personally prefer different elf implementations)
• Transmog (dislikes it existing, but appreciates a toggle)
• Updated graphics (liked, but wants an OG graphics toggle)
• Camping system (social buff via profession interactions; not loved but not hated)

Gamers / Sources Featured (Mentioned)

Named Creators / Gamers

• Calvish
• Peekaboo
• Cubsy (also team members: Dazed, Whiz K)
• Savix
• Shroud
• Fritz
• Swifty
• Bean, Joker, Fen, Pika, Tyler1, Soda, Caros, Max, Ziko, Ven
• Mudkip
• Alex
• Taylor (in chat)
• Chris (described as an OG classic veteran on the team)
• John, Kyle, Jean, Alex (Blizzard/shoutouts mentioned)
  • John explicitly said “John Blizzard”
  • Kyle/Jean/Alex also credited as helpful

Brands / Publications Mentioned

• Blizzard
  • Confirmed: no WoW token / no boosts
  • Provided explanations related to dungeon XP and itemization
• Icy Veins
  • Cited article: “Wow Forever cuts dungeon kill XP, but makes dungeon quest more rewarding”